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Post by frijoleluna on Jun 12, 2007 16:13:10 GMT -5
This goes back to the question we had a the meeting (with a twist however), "should we make mouth protection mandatory?"
I do think even if everyone observed MED's perfectly and we lowered the fps limits, teeth would still get chipped. I think this way b/c our Birmingham field is CQB, has much looser rules than Weaver (almost no rules), has high fps AEG's and sniper rifles and have only had one chipped tooth. We also play EVERY sunday so the potential for injury is higher simply because we play more. i have had blood drawn on several occasions from hot bb's. the shooters weren't trying to hurt me, they were trying to send me back to the respawn. one thing is certain about airsoft though, bb's are going to hit you, and it's probably going to hurt. if i was really worried about it hurting, i would always wear a long sleeve shirt (i was wearing a sleeveless one of the times i had blood drawn). however, i could care less about being hit with 6mm bb's unless it's over 350 at point blank range. that's just me though. have a grain of salt.
I still play in sleeveless shirts sometimes.
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Rook
Steel City Airsoft Member
We Will Put There Name To The Test
Posts: 270
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Post by Rook on Jun 12, 2007 16:23:12 GMT -5
And it is totally realistic that Weaver has had more teeth chipped in the last year than every feild in Georgia combined. Especially since one guy can monitor all the teeth that have been chipped. That is a totally plausible thing to say.
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Post by charleynovember on Jun 12, 2007 16:29:10 GMT -5
Why does it seem that the SCA team is so adamant about the upped FPS rules? Do you guys all own AEG's that are 400-415 and or sniper rifles that are right around 600? We have used 400 and 550 for several years and have had very few incidents with that limit why up it over in AL?
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Post by charleynovember on Jun 12, 2007 16:31:17 GMT -5
Ok Weaver has had more teeth chipped in a year than Georgia Airsoft has had in two....What number are we talking about here anyways for Weaver. Perhaps more GA players wear face masks maybe it is as simple as that? That would explain it right away.
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mateba
4/20 K AAV & Steel City Airsoft
Posts: 426
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Post by mateba on Jun 12, 2007 17:44:57 GMT -5
No, our guns are no faster than the next guy's. Most are in the 320-360 area but we do have 380, stock FPS and a 550++ sniper (KJW M700). Saying 400 or 415 at 30 is not a big difference. And I think you are right about those face masks. We might have a half a dozen people who wear PB masks and maybe another with some other face protection. Is that 550 with a 100 or 50 foot MED?
Could you please include the MED
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Tripps
Sergeant
I'm a freakin' ninja!!
Posts: 155
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Post by Tripps on Jun 12, 2007 18:42:44 GMT -5
Well, the round robin of this conversation is amusing!
The point I would like to bring up between the sniper rifle (550-600 fps. at 100 ft.) and the SAW (416-460 fps at 100 ft.) is 10 rpm (minute not seconds) vs 720 (12 x 60) rpm. Just imagine that in the city...(*shudder*)
Also, any sniper worth their salt will use a .3-.36 rd in a 500+ gun. A SAW will more then likely use a .25. I'd roughly guesstimate that makes the effective range of both the same....
On a different matter. I have almost "warmed up" to the 415. But, why buck the system? Several teams/organization/fields use the 400 fps. on AEG's and 550 on sniper rifles. These particular fps. limits keep you able to play at other fields and larger games.
Of your own admission, most of the guns you play with are stock to 380. Whats with the dire urge to push the envelope?
I've found that 350 fps. and a good hop-up will keep a high rof and and enable you to use .2's (.23's for good bush-cutting). You can be as (if not more then) effective as the 415 guy using .25's with that "okay" rof.
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Post by charleynovember on Jun 12, 2007 18:51:56 GMT -5
100' for 550fps
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mateba
4/20 K AAV & Steel City Airsoft
Posts: 426
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Post by mateba on Jun 12, 2007 19:31:10 GMT -5
Tripps, I didn't say most of our guns are at 380. I said they are 320-360. We have one that is 380. SAWs we be 100' from CQB. They are not allowed in the town and the surrounding 30' outside the town is also considered CQB. the same for Snipers. The common system of "400 and 550" is with 30' and 50' MEDs. I understand "if it aint broke dont fix it" but besides that we are introducing over twice the MED. This might not work with the cover at weaver but when it was discussed Mongo insisted on a 100' MED. I didnt hear much opposition then. We have all seen SAW limits at 450FPS. I didn't think we were pushing it that much couple with a 100' MED. And the point was to encourage squad tactics.
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electricblu
Steel City Airsoft Member
A life without fear is a short but glorius one.
Posts: 344
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Post by electricblu on Jun 12, 2007 19:47:49 GMT -5
Ok, I havent said jack so far so Im gonna go put my hard headed SCA opinion towards the topics at hand, so listen closely, because i dont plan on repeating myself because this all gives me a headache when i dont get to discuss things in person...
OK, NO STEEL CITY AIRSOFT DOES NOT HAVE ANYONE SHOOTING OVER 415FPS NOT EVEN 400FPS FOR THAT MATTER. YES WE HAVE A M700 THAT CHIPPED A TOOTH BUT IT WAS ABOUT 100ft AWAY ON A COLD DAY, so not really a 550+ on that day.
The whole reason we have teeth getting chipped is because we do not require face masks. Thats obvious. But most of us dont want face protection. I know for a fact that you will never get me into a paintball mask. Its awkward trying to press your cheek up to the stock on an m16 wearing a mask. I could possibly wear a mouth peice but thats it but even then youll have to hear me bitch because i cant breath good and i talk funny. Even if I cover my mouth with any type of mask it makes my glasses fog up. Foggy glasses are no fun and im not playing airsoft for the ladies. I think the CQB waiver is enough to cover the whole face and mouth protection issue.
I personally did not take to the saw gunner at 450fps too well. I didnt think they was a need for it. Most people cannot even create a monster like that and ot run for even 10 rounds. But me and Mateba know how to do it(not because we have secrets or because we are the best and most knowledgable techs out there... its because we have no life and read about airsoft stuff way too much and have too much extra money to spend, and dare i say it...we are never satisfied with the performance of our airsoft gun more me than him on that last one) and he was in the process of building a monster. But I dont really have a dog it that fight, it doesnt concern me because i dont plan on building a saw like that anytime soon and im not aiming anything at anyone else, so dont take it the wrong way, but i personally dont care it i get shot with 415 or 550 or whatever. Not because im chuck norris, but because im young and I am not concerned with my well being, member us teenagers think we are invincible. simple as that.
Next issue: Snipers im fine with 550fps, i dont really think it has to go much higher if some people are concerned. I think once your at those kind of FPS limits and range, youll have to be more worried about your projectile and weather conditions.
Okay, the 415 and were it comes from.... Say you had a CA m4 cqb, well you want it shooting harder and more accurate, so you drop an m120 and a 6.03 tightbore. Well, i think once the spring wears in(and you have good compression) you will be shooting around 395 because the tightbore will give you a boost in fps. Ok well say i see joe with his new m4 cqb and im like "hey thats so accurate and it shoots way farther, im going to go put those upgrades in my gun and hey, i just happen to be good at upgrades and making sure my compression is perfect!" so then i go put those upgrades in my gun. Well when i go chrono im shooting 408. Why because i chose a good compression setup with a MUCH longer tightbore and I chose a pdI spring that didnt wear in as much. Oh crap, I just wanted to have better accuracy and longer range and the internet people told me that the pdi spring was the equivelent to the m120. So now im stuck on semi auto. BOOOO! I know the cases are rare but i think they need to be taken in to consideration. ITs not because we like pain, its just because we like a little leadway just incase some upgrades work better than others.
so with all that being said, DO NOT KNOCK STEEL CITY BECAUSE WE LIKE THE SET FPS LIMITS AND LACK OF FACE PROTECTION. we want it to be up to the player, on the cqb waiver it will say, hey we have had many teeth chipped an many bloody faces because players chose to go without face protection, its strongly advised. And parents will see this and say hey johnny you have to wear a paintball mask, or i dont want you playing this airsoft its not safe. And thus it eliminates possible lawsuit happy mothers. We can even make a box that says check here if you require your child to wear full face protection.
SCA recruits younger players in general, so we prefer rules that we think are appealing to younger players. Young players 16-late 20's are usually pushing for higher limits because they dont worry as much. And we really target 16 year olds and above. Do we not, with the waivers and having to have a guardian if your under 16.
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mateba
4/20 K AAV & Steel City Airsoft
Posts: 426
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Post by mateba on Jun 12, 2007 20:02:05 GMT -5
HEY! I have a life! I'm just a little nerdy about airsoft.
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Rook
Steel City Airsoft Member
We Will Put There Name To The Test
Posts: 270
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Post by Rook on Jun 12, 2007 20:11:41 GMT -5
On a further note I have not heard any of the people who have had their teeth shot out (like jeff) bitching about lack of rules or MED or any of that. He just took it as it came. He knows he signed the waiver and he knows its part of the game.
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Post by charleynovember on Jun 12, 2007 20:22:09 GMT -5
but it doesn't shoot way farther...
Don't get all defensive about SCA. I was asking out of curiosity guys. You seemed to be the champions of these rules curious if there was a reason behind it.
The range difference between a gun shooting 350, 380, 400 is pretty slight. So tune to be as close to 400 as you like but don't go over it or if you do make it a negligable amount say 405 or less. If you make it 415 pretty soon you have people showing up with guns shooting 421 and saying hey it is barely over the limit let me play so on so forth...
Bitching? We were sort of invited to bitch. I was laying low.
You guys keep saying how you don't care because you are young and the young think they are invincable....maybe the people that are older...some much older know better?
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mateba
4/20 K AAV & Steel City Airsoft
Posts: 426
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Post by mateba on Jun 12, 2007 20:30:31 GMT -5
I believe there is a difference between 350 and 400. Its about the same difference between 415 and 460. I you use the FPS for nothing else, shooting heavy BBs .25 and .28 will improve accuracy and effective range.
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Rook
Steel City Airsoft Member
We Will Put There Name To The Test
Posts: 270
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Post by Rook on Jun 12, 2007 21:22:24 GMT -5
Yeah and evertime a debate comes up its always seems like everyone should bow down to you because you have been in airsoft longer. I dont even know why anyone debates with you guys because you have been serious into airsoft for what? Six years I think it was, if I recall correctly, so of course you are always right. And everyone keeps talking about the fps and med rules that are currently instated in all these places. Well, things change. It happens all the time.
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Tripps
Sergeant
I'm a freakin' ninja!!
Posts: 155
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Post by Tripps on Jun 12, 2007 22:06:58 GMT -5
Hehe, there's the old quit-yer-bitchen attitude!!!
So, instead of listening to people that organize events, have gone through the same situations, and have pioneered this game so that we "kids" can play, we should start bashing them for having experience. Mighty productive.
Sorry, but this "bitch" is done. You kids have fun...
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